Poll

I already said, our public servers are for relaxed and fun play. b00bsnight we play seriously, and so do we most matches.

Stacking teams 6 vs 3 and being assholes on purpose is OK.  (And KEEPING it that way f for 10 minutes straight?)
0 (0%)
Admins should not take 5 - 10 minutes to notice this.
0 (0%)
Orphal should have been temp banned 1 day for being such a douchebag.
1 (100%)
You got your friends back, but, tell him when he's so clearly wrong.
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 1

Voting closed: February 23, 2014, 03:50:38 AM

Author Topic: Orphal cheating today  (Read 9190 times)

Critofur

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Orphal cheating today
« on: August 02, 2010, 12:26:44 AM »
Orphal taking uneven team caps and telling me to shut up when I complain.  That's the worst kind of cheat, capping with teams like 6 vs 3 and the winning team just keeps capping.  It is so disrespectful and un-sportsman.  Worse than using an aimbot in my opinion.

I'll upload the screenshot I took seconds after he capped.



Taking a cap when teams are uneven is not just disrespectful, it's cheating.  There's no debate about it, black and white, cut-and-dry.  Cheating, plain and simple.  Worse than aimbotting I'd say.  And when it's an admin, not a noob, it's doubly shameful.  When some asshole replies "QQ" about people complaining about the cheat man that gets my blood boiling - I'd go to his house and cut his internet, if I didn't have a wife and kid to think of (one of Orphal's teamates at the time, the one with the racist name).
If you were told teams were bad 5 minutes ago, you laugh at the person who told you and call them crybaby, then you cap 5 more times - you are the worst kind of scum in multi-payer games, you are worse than noobs using aimbots and wallhacks.  Do NOT say you are not cheating, it's absurd.

Slash

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2010, 12:50:19 AM »
Come on Critofur, this is ridiculous. I hate when people refuse to autobalance teams too, but this was different, we were just playing and didn't pay attention to it. Then Orphal autobalanced teams just after this.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2010, 12:52:25 AM by // »

Orphal

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2010, 01:15:58 AM »
Critofur, I'm not watching at teams every 5 secs. 2 reds go away, so teams was unfair, yeah, but I diddn't see it before you tell me, and I to !teams right after.

You tell me 2 AFK names before that, I've force them spec right after and I've do !teams. You tell me one come again and AFK again, I force it spec and I died for that, I was at Lobby in blue.

I ask you to stop complaining because you were talking about cheat where there was not. I haven't cap especially because we were most in blue, I don't need that to cap flag.

Do !register, I think you can do !teams yourself, not sure.
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Critofur

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2010, 04:40:33 AM »
Sure, you helped balance the teams, but - the score was 8 to 1 already another player capped with unbalanced teams even though I said several times to stop and fix the teams first, then teams either still or again unbalanced I said OVER AND OVER DONT'T CAP STOP TEAMS and Oprah still capped.

I've seen it too many times, unbalanced teams, assholes on the winning team just think it's funny to keep capping even if they have two, three, even four more players - I hate uneven cap cheats worse than aimbotters.

It's ludicrous to try to weasel your way out claiming "I didn't know" teams were uneven, we all know that is purely bs.

If you were told teams were bad 5 minutes ago, you laugh at the person who told you and call them crybaby, then you cap 5 more times - you are the worst kind of scum in multi-payer games, you are worse than noobs using aimbots and wallhacks.  Do NOT say you are not cheating, it's absurd.

The-spiki

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2010, 07:32:58 AM »
Hi,

Since you are old time player on our servers and i kinda like(d) you and your competitiveness i will reply to all your lines one by one in hope to share my view on all of this and that disputes like this wont occur again... and there will be no need for drastic measures.

Consider these pieces of information next time there is a problem...

When i started first server, i did it so me and my friends would have nice place to play. Over time it got immensely popular and we got dozens of regulars who drop by often for their b00b fix.  I believe many players like how we run things. Sometimes incidents occur, but almost all of the time i think time spent playing on our servers is pleasant. If not, i don't know how and why we would have 130-200 players concurrently playing on our servers... Think again, 200 players at same time...
Due to our different preferences, i opened many other servers, some ctf, some ts, some changing maps some uptown only, some for other games.
All that takes a LOT of work. Be assured it is much more than you could imagine. Most of that work goes unnoticed. I have to say sometimes it is also unappreciated by some players.

Understand that sometimes we want to actually play instead of constantly spew out commands. Orphal is doing lions share of work, and has been doing it for long time. Some others burned out doing it. To mention a few that you may remember: The_noobit, gdl357, MasterBlaster. I am also constantly on the verge of exploding. Many times i regret letting this to develop this big.

Nowadays Orphal is solely reviewing all demos of cheaters sent to us and taking care of other things too. I will do whatever i can to protect him from being harassed even if it means i have to ban whole continent.
 
Orphal has been playing with me almost every day for long time, probably about year and a half. We talk almost every day. I would most probably back him up even if I though he did wrong.

To put this into perspective, i expelled long time player and member yukete who i had tons of good times because he was abusing others.
Also recently banned long time players Rated and Spiderman31 because of their improper behavior towards some other members. For some reason i had to explain it plainly like this. IF i have to chose between Zero vs Rated and Spiderman I chose Zero. He's been around for almost a year, he's been playing on my favorite server more than me, is only one who has better score than me and is much better with me on personal level. Easy choice.

Some time ago, for reason unknown to me i had to explain Dan that i don't like you anywhere near enough to allow you to bully him. He tempbanned you and you returned couple of times with DanIsPussy and other derogatory nicknames. I would not waste time, energy and nerves and for sure permban you on the spot.
Told Dan to that if you continue next time.
Also told Orphal to do it if you continue this story with him.
I for one take a lot of crap from some people pissing me off on purpose without punishing appropriately but won't allow others to do that to my mates.
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The-spiki

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2010, 07:33:42 AM »
Bear in mind that i can, and did extract chat logs...

> Orphal taking uneven team caps and telling me to shut up when I complain.
He forced 3 players into spec and only told you to shut up when you complained about unfair cap for the umpth time. What is wrong with that? IMO, he should have muted you then and tempban you if you avoid mute. Permban you if you avoid the tempban.

He can't know if someone in your team is afk. If you inform him, he reacts. Simple as that. It's your own fault that you don't have !teams or admin on the server.

You should have noticed by now that I do not pause whole game and make someone go back and return the flag if teams are uneven or subtract points of team with extra player or any other shenanigans like that. I hear some admins on some other servers do that, but i didn't, don't and won't. There are at least 50-70 rounds played on that server every day.

> That's the worst kind of cheat, capping with teams like 6 vs 3 and the winning team just keeps capping.  It is so disrespectful and un-sportsman.  Worse than using an aimbot in my opinion.

I strongly disagree. That is not cheating. Unfair cap is unfair cap and not cheating. Definitely not in same category as aimbot. WTF.

We made lots of regulars admins, plenty of people have access to !forceteam player spec and tons of people can do !teams.

Whenever i do !makereg playername, it allows that player to use !teams.

You got at least !makereg Critofur a lot of times but you change guid (to avoid temp ban) so you lose that over and over again.

« Last Edit: August 04, 2010, 08:08:01 AM by The-spiki »
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Critofur

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2010, 05:40:47 PM »
> I strongly disagree. That is not cheating. Unfair cap is unfair cap and not cheating. Definitely not in same category as aimbot. WTF.

Let me explain in depth:

Same old story happens over and over and over and over.  One team is doing well, maybe some friends are playing together and it ends up stacking the teams.  Ok, have to live with that too bad.  Other team has lots of noobs, some get frustrated and leave, as can be expected...   Ok, have to accept that too.  So the stacked team is winning having a grand old time.  A couple of us old timers might join and go to the loosing team try to balance things out.  Things get evened up a bit, the stacked team no longer is just capping at will, maybe it might turn into a good match...  But no, more of the frustrated noobs leave.   Somebody says TEAMS!  somebody else says teams, I say teams a dozen times.  The stacked team rushes in, grabs the flag caps, we keep yelling TEAMS!!! they do it again.   I say stop cheating, they say QQ : "Cry more Crytofur"...  And they KEEP doing it. 

Now, sometimes, some of the admins will do a !teams command nice and quick.  Other times, we might have two, even three AFKs on the loosing team.  And sometimes, (I know this for a fact) some people are AFK on purpuse.   They get forced spec, maybe even kicked, then they reconnect, and AFK again.  Sometimes they move once in a while, or play for just a minute, then back to AFK.

What does it mean to cheat?  Sure, pretty much anybody agrees aimbot is cheat.  But, it's usually noobs that aimbot, and even if it's not a noob, I can usually still beat the botter.  What I can't beat is when the server has 10 - 20 players and one side has 3 - 4 extras.  So that type of cheating bothers me more.

What bothers me the MOST is when people say that going ahead and capping when people have been saying "DO NOT CAP" and "TEAMS ARE BAD" over and over and over, is not cheating.  I don't understand why anybody would argue that it is not cheating, other than if they just hate me and want to goad me because they know how much I hate it?

Unlike some people who get mad, I don't resort to cheating.  If I was like many other players, when I got upset at Orphal's unsportsmanlike behavior, I would have gone out and got some cheats and carefully used them so as to not get caught.  I do not have any cheats, have never had cheats, and never will.  But if I did, I am sure that I am smart enough that I could use them without getting caught.

I understand that Orphal, and other admins would like to PLAY and not spend the whole time policing and typing commands.  Also, I get tired of changing my IP address and chaning my GUID because (IMO) admins have been unreasonable and temp banned/banned me because I complain about cheats so much.  I would go so far as to us a proxy in another country, if I had to, to avoid what to me is an unfair ban.  I can't tolerate being banned for trying to make the game more FAIR.




If you were told teams were bad 5 minutes ago, you laugh at the person who told you and call them crybaby, then you cap 5 more times - you are the worst kind of scum in multi-payer games, you are worse than noobs using aimbots and wallhacks.  Do NOT say you are not cheating, it's absurd.

The-spiki

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2010, 06:09:17 PM »
What you describe is "normal" happening on public servers.
That is why we have b00bsnight on Fridays, to which we invite about half of b00bs who are not goofing around all the time and some regulars. We play seriously 2-7 hours straight, depending on mood.
That is also why some b00bs play "real" matches. Clan wars. Couple of them every week. 5 vs 5, 6 vs 6.

Access to !teams command is granted to anyone who asks. You had it too. Stop evading tempbans by changing id and you'll have it. I've recently started thinking about making mod's (moderators) getting privilege to forceteam, so they could move AFK'ers... but it will open another can of worms because i sense it will be missused by some to even up teams by rearranging all the time.

If you behaved more appropriately, you would for sure got admin by now. And with that possibility to force afk'ers to spec.
I am not talking only about your constant complaints in game...

Whenever i am around and notice someone is going from spec into game and again afk, i force lock him to spec for the reminder of that round.

Unfair cap is not cheat. Ask anybody :)
The "do not cap", "teams are bad" etc cannot be enforced and thus cannot be rule on [b00bs] servers. There are around 70 rounds per day on main servers.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2010, 06:41:46 PM by The-spiki »
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Critofur

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2010, 06:19:39 PM »
Read through the thread again - come on guys, that's really weak to say "I can't check teams every 5 seconds" because I had been spending more time complaining about teams than playing for about 5 consecutive caps! 

Look at the screenshot.  10 : 1, teams 6 vs 3.  Don't try to defend your actions, it just makes you look bad even more.  This is just one example of what happens time and time again.

Look further at the screenshot, I am the only player with anywhere NEAR a positive score (more points than deaths) and yet, the blue team has 5 players that have all been there 10 minutes with none of them willing to even TRY to even things up.  They just have more fun laughing at the poor red player "QQ".

You [pretty much all of players who do this] get all defensive and offended when you're told the uneven cap is a cheat?  What's the difference?  Even if it was reasonable to try to say it's not a cheat cap, then it's OK???  Come on.  Some kid trying an aimbot, or a walhack, maybe he's just curious, but this, this is sometimes veteran players even PURPOSEFULLY being rude, unfair, disrespectful, and laughing while they do it.

If you want to play me 2-vs-1, I'm up for that, but that's voluntary and not ruining the whole server for 5 - 6, maybe even 10 players on the side without enough players.  I don't think any fair-minded and reasonable person should tolerate the actions like those of the blue team shown in the screenshot I posted.  To NOT call it cheating, and to not complain until IT STOPS would be irresponsible.
If you were told teams were bad 5 minutes ago, you laugh at the person who told you and call them crybaby, then you cap 5 more times - you are the worst kind of scum in multi-payer games, you are worse than noobs using aimbots and wallhacks.  Do NOT say you are not cheating, it's absurd.

Critofur

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2010, 06:25:36 PM »
Spiki: you've never temp banned me for a reason:  I am always reasonable.  If you talk to me, I respond.  Maybe I've given you a little grief sometimes, you had to tell me more than once.

Those who have temp banned me have typically behaved in an asshole manner, and I think it was entirely appropriate to evade their lame temp bans.

If I had to, I would go so far as to change IPs, maybe even move to a new state, to avoid a ban that I did not feel was fair.

Once I was banned simply for asking if somebody was using a bot.

Once I was banned because I called a vote that got the admin kicked off his own server (he had taken a cap while teams were uneven in what had previously been a very good intense match).

EDIT: Oh, but I have NEVER been banned for cheating.  I have been kicked by noob admins who thought I was cheating, but not banned.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2010, 06:30:15 PM by Critofur »
If you were told teams were bad 5 minutes ago, you laugh at the person who told you and call them crybaby, then you cap 5 more times - you are the worst kind of scum in multi-payer games, you are worse than noobs using aimbots and wallhacks.  Do NOT say you are not cheating, it's absurd.

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2010, 06:35:06 PM »
Critofur, I don't understand what you don't get.

It's this simple:Cheating in Urban Terror is generally defined as abusing the game in some form that is not specifically allowed in the code. This is normally construed as using outside code (an aimbot or wallhack) that affect the game, or using a glitch not intentionally put forward in the game (getting on top of a map).

What you're describing is unsportsman-like behavior. Is it unfair? Sure. Is it cheap? Also sure. Does it count as cheating? Nope. Using language correctly is regarded as a fundamental human skill of communication. Please learn to do so.

Beyond that, if you don't like the rules or actions of a server admin or owner-Don't play there. You do not pay for the servers. You do not contribute to the cleaning up of the servers. You don't help run the servers. In other words, you have no right to make the rules on any server in which you are not directly involved in. Deal with it.

Also-Evading temp bans would result in an automatic perm ban from me. I don't care if you can evade, I'd just ban on sight. If you have a problem with an admins action, come to the forums and complain. Arguing on the server is counterproductive and just plain rude. The admin wants you gone. Get gone until you have a reasonable venue (here) to make your case.


The-spiki

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2010, 07:26:31 PM »
Crito,

For some reason you are constantly avoiding commenting on my main point and that is that (unfair cap is not cheating) and this could have been avoided...

You had access to !teams in the past. Simple !teams would fix the teams.

You could have admin and access to !force etc if you were not behaving inappropriately when you think i'm not looking. For example, saying this server sucks and then spamming connection string for some other server asking people to join there etc...

Many admins, including me, cannot police server all the time and sometimes just want to play. Plain and simple. Can not. Many times i do not pay much attention to game, because i at the same time watch comedy, do web surfing, read my emails and whatnot. Also chat on teamspeak (gaming voice/audio chat) with our other members and regulars who idle there with us.

Now, i suggest you to go and read this.
b00bs-clan.com/urtrules
b00bs-clan.com/urtadmins

If you do not agree with above written, then feel free to enjoy current state.

If you send me email confirming that you read and agree with stuff there, i will make you admin or mod, with which you will be able to force afk'ers in spec etc. Bear in mind that i do not condone people being kicked for AFK, !shuffleteams or restart of round being used, or forcing players to "make team more even" and such stuff. Try to limit yourself to actions such as !teams and forcing afk'ers to spec and not harassing anyone. (kicking for unfair cap etc comes to mind :)

On the ban evasion note... That is IMO lame. Why not just quit playing on servers who are run the way you don't like? At most complain on the forums. Many times admins didn't permanently banned you even when you crossed the line, because they think i like you. I mean, I do like how competitive you are in spirit, but don't like you that much as a person.

I've been working in ISP (Internet Service Provider) field for hmz, about 14+ years. Proxy, this and that, don't worry, if you were some serious problem for me/us i could track you if i had will and time to do it :)
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Critofur

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2010, 08:19:16 PM »
Crito,

For some reason you are constantly avoiding commenting on my main point and that is that (unfair cap is not cheating) and this could have been avoided...

I constantly address that point.  I don't see how anyone could even argue that it is not cheating.  In ANY team  competition such as futbol, football, baseball, basketball, etc. etc. if one of the teams put extra players on the field any score would not count.  If they tried to do it again, they (the whole team) would be disqualified and ejected from the match.

I am addressing the issue here on the forum - I was playing today and got fed up with Orphal's poor behavior and left.

If I'm playing on Boobs, and there's another good player, but a bunch of people start being jerks because there's no Admin on, what's the harm in asking the good player if they want to try another server?  Why wouldn't you want me to do that??? 

If you were told teams were bad 5 minutes ago, you laugh at the person who told you and call them crybaby, then you cap 5 more times - you are the worst kind of scum in multi-payer games, you are worse than noobs using aimbots and wallhacks.  Do NOT say you are not cheating, it's absurd.

pure season

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2010, 08:30:44 PM »
 Critofur,
             
             Do you have an email? or a teamspeak because many of us hangout there and some of us pay attention to our emails and respond quickly do yourself a favor and before ranting someone who was here for so long and does more then expected,
give spiki a quick email or other admins i for one am a Mod on the US server so if there is a problem there you can email anyone and the problem would be resolved dont just go out of the blue and call someone in negative ways...
enough said can we all just forget about this and just play?!?!?
ITS ONLY A GOD DAMN GAME IF YOU THINK THIS IS SERIOUS GET A LIFE!

and also im not on anyone sides just posting my opinion :).



Critofur

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Re: Orphal cheating today
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2010, 08:38:45 PM »
Spiki - give me a while to cool down before I talk to you about being Admin. 

I take it too personally when people are disrespectful of others by being AFK without switching to SPEC and I think that being auto-kicked for that would be entirely appropriate as reconnecting is extremely simple and easy, no?

Admins could just play and not waste time forcing players to spec so often.   I'm sure some people don't take the game nearly as seriously, and don't care much if somebody is AFK, or if people quickly grab 2 - 3 bad caps while teams are bad. 

If anybody indicates to me that they are bothered by my trash talking, I stop.  I offer an apology if they seem really upset.  But typically, I thought trash talking is just part of a game like this - it's even built in to most games like Urban Terror.  I enjoy trying to be creative, coming up with particularly insulting (IN GAME) trash talking. 

In the game, you SHOOT people - but it's a game - it seems entirely appropriate for such a violent game, which not only includes shooting, but descriptive phrases of frags, foul language in "radio" binds, and "curb stomping", that the more foul-mouthed, dirty, and insulting one could be, the better.

Some people don't take insults as "in game" and for that reason, I suppose it'd be better if I didn't have a "T"alk command at all...  I wish there could be some kind of color coding, or some kind of tool with which you could make your trash talk binds clear that it is GAME TRASH TALK and not like some kind of personal insult pasted on your facebook page or emailed to you...

Anway - maybe if I stick to weird insults like the Japanese: OMAI WA MO SHIN DE ERU, "Step aside, let the man go through" and, "Nice Catch!" those don't go over the line the way something like insulting someone's race, gender, sexual orientation, or mental ability directly?

My favorite would be if someone sampled the "Easy Button" and you could play the sound in game...

I played Dan 1-vs-1 after all that insulting, I thought he was not upset about anything.  At the beginning, it seemed like I was going to have an easy win.  After a couple minutes, it was clear he was faster than me, and a good player.  But, I did have an issue with hit detection - I was getting absolutely terrible hits starting a few minutes into our last match such that the game was basically unplayable for me.  I went ahead and finished anyway though.  I watched the demo later, I could see that some of the time I was just not playing great.  But I also saw that sometimes the demo was not showing the same thing that I saw while I was playing. 

I'll have to get him to play me 1-vs-1 a few more times.  I was playing on the 30+ server the other day and it was working flawlessly, no problems with lag or hit detection.  I don't know if the connection will be good from his end on that server though - being on the other side of the "pond"....
If you were told teams were bad 5 minutes ago, you laugh at the person who told you and call them crybaby, then you cap 5 more times - you are the worst kind of scum in multi-payer games, you are worse than noobs using aimbots and wallhacks.  Do NOT say you are not cheating, it's absurd.